Comments on: Fate/stay night in Review: Symbols and Motifs, Tying the Thematic Threads http://blog.eternicity.net/2009/11/23/fatestay-night-in-review-symbols-and-motifs-tying-the-thematic-threads/ In search of anime enlightenment Wed, 30 Nov 2011 00:25:27 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Roarke http://blog.eternicity.net/2009/11/23/fatestay-night-in-review-symbols-and-motifs-tying-the-thematic-threads/comment-page-1/#comment-7321 Roarke Sat, 19 Feb 2011 05:13:14 +0000 http://blog.eternicity.net/?p=2638#comment-7321 I like it. I like it alot. You don't need to worry about being correct about the whole "Shirou's Magic = Shirou's Mind" analogy; it was explicitly stated within the novel to be true. "The only thing I can do is put shape to my mind." Shirou has little/no talent for orthodox magic like Rin. He can only do the one magic that fully encompasses his entire being. In a way, HF is something I cannot stand to like or dislike. I just feel non-directional passion for it. I enjoy trolling people who are very passionately in love with the route, but I can't deny the morals, the sheer excellence of the story. Sakura, to me, was just a symbolic MacGuffin, though. One of the lower points. But the Normal End prevents me from saying she didn't deserve the True End. I really feel for Kotomine Kirei. A man with the inability to find happiness in anything but the suffering of others? A year ago, you couldn't have convinced me to feel sympathy for that. But I do. I do want some mapo tofu... I like it. I like it alot. You don’t need to worry about being correct about the whole “Shirou’s Magic = Shirou’s Mind” analogy; it was explicitly stated within the novel to be true.
“The only thing I can do is put shape to my mind.” Shirou has little/no talent for orthodox magic like Rin. He can only do the one magic that fully encompasses his entire being.
In a way, HF is something I cannot stand to like or dislike. I just feel non-directional passion for it. I enjoy trolling people who are very passionately in love with the route, but I can’t deny the morals, the sheer excellence of the story. Sakura, to me, was just a symbolic MacGuffin, though. One of the lower points. But the Normal End prevents me from saying she didn’t deserve the True End.
I really feel for Kotomine Kirei. A man with the inability to find happiness in anything but the suffering of others? A year ago, you couldn’t have convinced me to feel sympathy for that. But I do. I do want some mapo tofu…

]]> By: Justice May Not Be For Heroes: Kiritsugu of Fate/zero | Major Arcana http://blog.eternicity.net/2009/11/23/fatestay-night-in-review-symbols-and-motifs-tying-the-thematic-threads/comment-page-1/#comment-6631 Justice May Not Be For Heroes: Kiritsugu of Fate/zero | Major Arcana Thu, 26 Aug 2010 22:35:06 +0000 http://blog.eternicity.net/?p=2638#comment-6631 [...] remark­ably appro­pri­ate not to do so. Fate/stay night has already approached the ques­tion of ‘what makes a hero’ from mul­ti­ple per­spec­tives, from the ide­al­ized (Unlim­ited Blade Works) to the [...] [...] remark­ably appro­pri­ate not to do so. Fate/stay night has already approached the ques­tion of ‘what makes a hero’ from mul­ti­ple per­spec­tives, from the ide­al­ized (Unlim­ited Blade Works) to the [...]

]]> By: Aorii http://blog.eternicity.net/2009/11/23/fatestay-night-in-review-symbols-and-motifs-tying-the-thematic-threads/comment-page-1/#comment-4773 Aorii Fri, 27 Nov 2009 16:43:06 +0000 http://blog.eternicity.net/?p=2638#comment-4773 Very nice exploration of the Fate/stay night themes. Although, the com­par­i­sons you identified regarding Heroism and self could also be applied to a number of other themes within the Fat­e­v­erse. To broaden out the scope, one can say that Nasu’s writ­ings are a crit­i­cal analy­sis by sto­ry­telling on “the def­i­n­i­tion of ideal within different scopes of black and white”. My attempts to delve into this further quickly ended up as a <a>sizable post of its own</a>, so I won't spam your comments here. Now since you've finished the Visual Novel, I recommend picking up the <em>Fate/zero</em> at <a href="http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Fate/Zero" rel="nofollow">Baka-tsuki</a> if you haven't already. It may not be written by Nasu, but it certainly does a great job of continuing the Fate/stay night saga, keeping up parallels on existing themes of the story. Very nice exploration of the Fate/stay night themes. Although, the com­par­i­sons you identified regarding Heroism and self could also be applied to a number of other themes within the Fat­e­v­erse. To broaden out the scope, one can say that Nasu’s writ­ings are a crit­i­cal analy­sis by sto­ry­telling on “the def­i­n­i­tion of ideal within different scopes of black and white”.

My attempts to delve into this further quickly ended up as a sizable post of its own, so I won’t spam your comments here.

Now since you’ve finished the Visual Novel, I recommend picking up the Fate/zero at Baka-tsuki if you haven’t already. It may not be written by Nasu, but it certainly does a great job of continuing the Fate/stay night saga, keeping up parallels on existing themes of the story.

]]> By: The Paths of Ideals and Kingship — Another look at Fate of Nasuverse | zanaikin | Major Arcana http://blog.eternicity.net/2009/11/23/fatestay-night-in-review-symbols-and-motifs-tying-the-thematic-threads/comment-page-1/#comment-4771 The Paths of Ideals and Kingship — Another look at Fate of Nasuverse | zanaikin | Major Arcana Fri, 27 Nov 2009 16:31:57 +0000 http://blog.eternicity.net/?p=2638#comment-4771 [...] Eternal’s review on the themes of Fate/stay night has got­ten my brains crank­ing again regard­ing this epic [...] [...] Eternal’s review on the themes of Fate/stay night has got­ten my brains crank­ing again regard­ing this epic [...]

]]> By: Martin http://blog.eternicity.net/2009/11/23/fatestay-night-in-review-symbols-and-motifs-tying-the-thematic-threads/comment-page-1/#comment-4689 Martin Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:34:46 +0000 http://blog.eternicity.net/?p=2638#comment-4689 Phew...blimey. It never ceases to amaze me how everyone who works their way through this finds something new to add! I recall reading IKnight's and Owen's posts and thinking "how can an interactive on-screen light novel thingy possibly say so much?" but eventually understood for myself by the end. What amazes me more than anything though is how watertight the writing is. I don't want to draw attention away from Takeuchi's artwork but Nasu's world-building is in a class of its own. No matter what angle I view it from I end up discovering something new to think about...then read someone else's take on it and think it over even more... What F/S N does, even more so than Tsukihime and possibly as much as Kara no Kyoukai, is do a merry dance all over the viewer's preconceptions regarding morality. Even the times when it sets a point of reference for who and what is 'good' or 'bad' it shifts perspectives, casts everything in a new light and makes you question some really fundamental concepts. Having characters from different periods of history really highlights how, when you're talking about thoughts and actions, good and bad is relative. I could go all tl;dr on this story all over again but one thing that really stuck with me is the way that love and devotion shine through in the darkest places. The whole story is mindblowing (I really want to re-read it now, thanks to you!) but it's amazing how I was often on the edge of my seat and occasionally shocked and disgusted but ultimately very moved by the emotional side of things. The memes have given it some noteriety but the levels of gore and smut shouldn't hide the fact that it's a superb and well-told story. Glad you enjoyed it, anyway - thanks for giving me such a great read too! Phew…blimey. It never ceases to amaze me how everyone who works their way through this finds something new to add! I recall reading IKnight’s and Owen’s posts and thinking “how can an interactive on-screen light novel thingy possibly say so much?” but eventually understood for myself by the end.

What amazes me more than anything though is how watertight the writing is. I don’t want to draw attention away from Takeuchi’s artwork but Nasu’s world-building is in a class of its own. No matter what angle I view it from I end up discovering something new to think about…then read someone else’s take on it and think it over even more…

What F/S N does, even more so than Tsukihime and possibly as much as Kara no Kyoukai, is do a merry dance all over the viewer’s preconceptions regarding morality. Even the times when it sets a point of reference for who and what is ‘good’ or ‘bad’ it shifts perspectives, casts everything in a new light and makes you question some really fundamental concepts. Having characters from different periods of history really highlights how, when you’re talking about thoughts and actions, good and bad is relative.

I could go all tl;dr on this story all over again but one thing that really stuck with me is the way that love and devotion shine through in the darkest places. The whole story is mindblowing (I really want to re-read it now, thanks to you!) but it’s amazing how I was often on the edge of my seat and occasionally shocked and disgusted but ultimately very moved by the emotional side of things. The memes have given it some noteriety but the levels of gore and smut shouldn’t hide the fact that it’s a superb and well-told story. Glad you enjoyed it, anyway – thanks for giving me such a great read too!

]]> By: Blowfish http://blog.eternicity.net/2009/11/23/fatestay-night-in-review-symbols-and-motifs-tying-the-thematic-threads/comment-page-1/#comment-4688 Blowfish Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:41:05 +0000 http://blog.eternicity.net/?p=2638#comment-4688 Great Review and Analysis of the Visual Novel. Theres nothing much I can really add here and I already mentioned why I prefered the UBW Route Over Heavens Feel while both easily beat the Fate Route in many,many ways. Overall I really liked how the Novel played with what a hero is,believes and sacrifices.The biggest strength is how UBW and HF showed us true different realities where Shirou once sacrificied himself for his believes and where he sacrificied his believes for himself. The Reader himself has to decide which Route he would take and whats wrong or right The Fate Route in contrast merely serves as an introduction and is in itself nothing more than a simple action story with a boy lending powers of a heroic spirit to defeat evil. Great Review and Analysis of the Visual Novel.
Theres nothing much I can really add here and I already mentioned why I prefered the UBW Route Over Heavens Feel while both easily beat the Fate Route in many,many ways.

Overall I really liked how the Novel played with what a hero is,believes and sacrifices.The biggest strength is how UBW and HF showed us true different realities where Shirou once sacrificied himself for his believes and where he sacrificied his believes for himself.
The Reader himself has to decide which Route he would take and whats wrong or right

The Fate Route in contrast merely serves as an introduction and is in itself nothing more than a simple action story with a boy lending powers of a heroic spirit to defeat evil.

]]> By: AstroNerdBoy http://blog.eternicity.net/2009/11/23/fatestay-night-in-review-symbols-and-motifs-tying-the-thematic-threads/comment-page-1/#comment-4680 AstroNerdBoy Tue, 24 Nov 2009 09:33:55 +0000 http://blog.eternicity.net/?p=2638#comment-4680 I loved the anime and lots of people have told me I need to do the visual novel(s). If I had more time. Your review supports the notion of how interesting the VN is. I loved the anime and lots of people have told me I need to do the visual novel(s). If I had more time. Your review supports the notion of how interesting the VN is.

]]> By: Hirobot http://blog.eternicity.net/2009/11/23/fatestay-night-in-review-symbols-and-motifs-tying-the-thematic-threads/comment-page-1/#comment-4676 Hirobot Tue, 24 Nov 2009 05:54:43 +0000 http://blog.eternicity.net/?p=2638#comment-4676 Awesome review. I am so intrigued by Fate/stay night already. I might just have to check it out soon. Awesome review. I am so intrigued by Fate/stay night already. I might just have to check it out soon.

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